#(I've seen people say her telling your to bury your hatred came off as abusive to them)

[inksandpensblog]

aha, I spy the element I'd failed to account for. I'd been looking at the chapter on its own without considering the player-choices in the previous chapter that led to it. that does shine a different light on it.

You've mentioned your dislike for HEA in several posts but I'm having a hard time pinpointing the exact source of your dislike. I've gotten the impression that you feel it's overrated (and thematically counterintuitive?) for favoring a more traditional form of intimacy in a game that built itself on depictions of non-traditional forms of intimacy. But some of your comments also gave me the impression that you mostly take issue with the dance ending being framed as romantic at all (both thematically and mechanically), as you believe it communicates something harmful about the type of relationship Princess and TLQ have by that point and in the leadup to it. I'm not sure I'm connecting all the same dots as you have and I'd like to understand your critique better.

I'll leave this as the last thing I say about it (negatively, anyways) for now, barring maybe a joke that's in the queue? Kind of tired of talking about it and there's only so much to say, lol.

My dislike of the dance is purely petty and I admit it. It feels very similar to the Thorn kiss, the Thorn kiss was already a HUGE moment in the main game, and learning it's labeled as a +2 satisfy variable in the code the same way the Thorn kiss is was like...bleghhhhh. As a scene, it's gorgeous, I'm not gonna pretend it isn't just to be a contrarian <- StP reference

I also don't think the player does enough to really earn it, in comparison to Thorn where you have to slowly get her to trust you enough to give the knife to you, and you can STILL stab her afterwards. We'll compare it to other +2 variables at the end, just for shits and giggles.

My dislike of HEA is...a lot more complicated. I'm sorry if the dots aren't quite connecting with the way I'm explaining it. I'll try and keep it concise, I know I've rambled quite a bit about it.

There's two Big Decisions the writers/narrative makes that combine into the dreaded Implication that I have vaguely referred to. These are: -Princess was badly hurt by us in previous chapters. Chapter 1 Princess hates killing us (her ending poem: "do i miss your heart because I can't stand to see it go?") Chapter 2 princess thought she was being rescued, then...suddenly wasn't. And, at the slightest hint of rejection, you brutally kill yourself in front of her. It doesn't matter that this was Smitten, because the Princess is unaware of the voices-she only sees US. And her response to that is to be incredibly welcoming to us and project all of her anxieties onto the shadow desperately trying to "make her happy" -The Smitten split. He kills us, then separates from our body, then does everything in his power to keep the Princess happy, including forcing us to sit down at the table and enjoy what he made for her. The game frames him as a literal shadow behind her, complete with a slasher-smile or grabbing at her, and some of his voice deliveries on the way to Damsel 3 are very...ominous in read and less Smitten-esque. I have beef with the execution of this-he felt very out of character in Damsel-leading-to-HEA, based on his Thorn characterization-but don't think it's bad as a concept.

Neither of these are bad artistic decision on their own, or in a vacuum. But what happens when you combine them is you get a narrative where you're...essentially rescuing a woman from the abuse you ended up putting her through, and she doesn't acknowledge you as the source of all of her pain.

It's compounded by factor after factor in HEA. You as the player are not allowed to toss around hypotheticals re: who's actually to blame for her suffering, or for this hell-dinner. You as the player are railroaded through the dinner into bonding with her-I tried to roleplay as the very asshole I'd need to be to see this route in the first place, and was still able to leave on good terms with her.

Not only is she not allowed to have any negative feelings towards the man who put her in this awful situation, just "We never really knew each other, did we?" when the princess is normally spiteful, petty, and grudge-holding, you as the player do not have much agency yourself, and unlike in Tower, Moment of Clarity, the Greys, or other routes where you've been railroaded into options by others, there is no real reason you're not allowed to say awful shit to this princess the way you are with Witch or Spectre or, hell, let's keep comparing this chapter to Thorn, the other traditional fairy-tale romance chapter.

I understand the dinner scene is a metaphor for slowly earning her trust again, making her realize you actually give a shit about her choices this time, that you aren't going to hurt one or both of you this time, but it doesn't work for me. Again, I was trying to be a dick and still managed to reassure her of these facts. It's a conversation, words without actions to back them. In Thorn, you're slowly, patiently waiting for her, then tenderly cut the vines once she gives you the means to do so. In HEA...you just...talk her through it. I guess. I understand the function of the dinner scene, that it's supposed to the be the part where you experience CONSEQUENCES for your ACTIONS and REDEEM YOURSELF to be able to leave with her...but for all the reasons above, it doesn't work for me.

The alternative being the burning of torches doesn't convince me I had choice or agency. It still requires a level of bonding with her. It still requires talking her through it.

It all combines into a narrative arc that echoes SO MUCH real-world domestic abuse, or at least domestic unhappiness, and you as the player get off scot-free and get to leave with your beloved in spite of all the pain you inflicted on her. The dance is not mandatory-you have to be a certain level of empathetic and open to her to get to dance with her-but it ends up as the icing on the bad-implications cake-and hopefully by this point it's clear what those implications are.

In case it's not, I'll rephrase it: Leaving with HEA, as the game currently presents it, felt like I was rescuing the princess from myself. Like I got to abuse her and she still loves me and it doesn't matter, because it wasn't actually me. My choices didn't matter.

It feels, in so many aspects, like a worse version of Thorn instead of a heartbreaking narrative about being trapped in a dying relationship like it's supposed to be. I wish she expressed any level of dislike for the player, because that would've sold the domestic-relationship-gone-wrong angle. I wish we were allowed to play with if the Smitten was a separate being from us or not, because that would've added so many fun layers to his actions that are left completely unexplored. And those two things would've killed the unfortunate implication that you can just...use and abuse her, but everything can still be okay between the two of you. This could've been the amicable divorce chapter. I would've loved an amicable divorce chapter. but the dance carries more weight than choosing to separate from someone you KNOW you've hurt, and who you have not meaningfully proven you won't hurt again.

anyways let's compare "dancing with the woman you've traumatized" to the other +2 variables because i do feel like being petty about that still

-Throwing the Wraith into the void is the only +2 deny variable in the main game, and the only one I'm aware of. You REALLY have to piss off the Princess to get Wraith in the first place, by killing Nightmare who's already kind of done with your shit or by throwing away your chance at redemption with Spectre, who is clearly Unkillable yet you're still trying to...and THEN you throw her into an eternal void, not even succeeding at slaying her, just to be petty. The "Why do you hate me?" line she gives after that hits so hard and perfectly explains why it's a +2 deny in comparison to other princess-slaying or princess-disappointment endings.

-Leaving with the Networked Wild is a +2 free variable, and again, the only one I'm aware of. It's such a unique ending, one where you're RIGHT at the cusp of leaving the construct itself, of course it deserves to stand out.

Which goes back to me being extremely petty re: the dance, the fact that the player has to be so unbelievably awful to the princess to see it and not do much to make up for their awfulness, and the fact that instead of the Kiss being unique, it's now All traditional romance scenes that give a +2, in a game where the devs repeatedly insist that everything is romantic/intimate/important. It's something so buried in the code it shouldn't matter, but it encapsulates so many of my issues re: Happily Ever After and it undermining previous messages re: player choices having consequences, all forms of intimacy being important, etc.